tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post2706326600503708757..comments2023-07-15T04:20:16.543-05:00Comments on Almost Diamonds: On CritiqueStephanie Zvanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-33662517441078253882008-07-19T14:23:00.000-05:002008-07-19T14:23:00.000-05:00Eden, I like kissing the ring, although, with this...Eden, I like kissing the ring, although, with this font placing the asterisk very high, it looks a bit like licking the ring. Not that there's anything wrong with that. :)<BR/><BR/>And no, my use of the smiley emoticon is not trite. It's minimalist and classic.Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-89013150479942631362008-07-19T08:20:00.000-05:002008-07-19T08:20:00.000-05:00I'm waffling between genuflection and kissing the ...I'm waffling between genuflection and kissing the ring. The second might be simpler and, when in doubt, edit:<BR/><BR/>:-*oStephaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18127448645515191294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-3256051948830347922008-07-18T13:30:00.000-05:002008-07-18T13:30:00.000-05:00I think I owe an apology.... The 'o h' thing only...I think I owe an apology.... <BR/><BR/><BR/>The 'o h' thing only works if the leading is much tighter than the default on this blog. Try it in a text editor, it works better.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-60479045048307916242008-07-18T13:16:00.000-05:002008-07-18T13:16:00.000-05:00Hi, Zuska. Thanks for the great link.Hi, Zuska. Thanks for the great link.Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-10776003780659109942008-07-18T12:46:00.000-05:002008-07-18T12:46:00.000-05:00BUt I'll be dollars to donuts that a third or more...<I>BUt I'll be dollars to donuts that a third or more of the sciencebloggers would not accept that distinction if applied to them. "The facts are what the facts are regardless of social context." is what you'll get.</I><BR/><BR/>Yes indeed, social context is of absolute importance when considering the meaning of facts, words, and actions. I absolutely agree. Readers here may be interested in a great post on just this topic over at <A HREF="http://field-negro.blogspot.com/2008/07/white-people-please-just-say-no-to-n.html" REL="nofollow">Field Negro</A>.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-12535511035571775792008-07-18T12:31:00.000-05:002008-07-18T12:31:00.000-05:00Eden, now I need an emoticon for genuflection. Any...<EM>Eden, now I need an emoticon for genuflection. Any ideas?</EM><BR/><BR/>takes two lines:<BR/><BR/><BR/><BR/>o<BR/>hAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-21391200942211609282008-07-18T12:28:00.000-05:002008-07-18T12:28:00.000-05:00Eden: Excellent demonstration of spring back from...Eden: Excellent demonstration of spring back from critique, however dumb the critique was.<BR/><BR/>Stephanie. I cannot speak for Randy, and although we do communicate I honestly cannot answer your question from anything he has indicated, but I can guess. I think that the difference between the two (the memo and the comment) is 36 hours of time.<BR/><BR/>I do honestly think Randy's memo includes information that is important and interesting. I thought there would be blow-back from sciencebloggers, and I assume Randy did too. That blowback would probably happen no matter what, so maybe there is nothing to do about it (science bloggers are so tickley sensitive).<BR/><BR/>But yes, in retrospect, I think it might have been better to walk away from this discussion, move on to the opening, etc. and then go back to the issue later on. In fact, I think that is what is happening now.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-64175743061401037822008-07-18T12:14:00.000-05:002008-07-18T12:14:00.000-05:00Eden, now I need an emoticon for genuflection. Any...Eden, now I need an emoticon for genuflection. Any ideas?Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-3754102249160480512008-07-18T12:09:00.000-05:002008-07-18T12:09:00.000-05:00My use of the wink was trite and expected. I shoul...My use of the wink was trite and expected. I should have used a fresher emoticon to convey my comment. I've always liked this one: <BR/>};-><BR/><BR/>This emoticon is meant only in the fiction writing context and not in the science writing context.Stephaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18127448645515191294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-60686930114646389162008-07-18T11:25:00.000-05:002008-07-18T11:25:00.000-05:00Greg saying Eden's ;) was ambiguous. I got right a...Greg saying Eden's ;) was ambiguous. I got right away what she was saying - but then again I know her too. But it seemed quite straight forward to me. :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-38091505179226509142008-07-18T11:14:00.000-05:002008-07-18T11:14:00.000-05:00Mari, which funny? And don't take Greg too serious...Mari, which funny? And don't take Greg too seriously, especially when he sounds serious.Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-76330463246342991062008-07-18T11:13:00.001-05:002008-07-18T11:13:00.001-05:00Greg, two things. One, having reread Randy's post ...Greg, two things. One, having reread Randy's post on erv, I have to ask: is this the same guy as the one who put out the memo?<BR/><BR/>Two, when I'm arguing with someone and I think they're going to say something totally wrong, I usually find it's better to let them say it instead of me, then point out how wrong it is. It makes it much harder for them to suggest I'm setting up strawmen. Of course, that doesn't mean I haven't set them up to say it....Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-84628408960813315992008-07-18T11:13:00.000-05:002008-07-18T11:13:00.000-05:00How so?How so?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-26147250036894579802008-07-18T11:11:00.000-05:002008-07-18T11:11:00.000-05:00Eden: I don't think you put that the best possibl...Eden: I don't think you put that the best possible way. Your comment is brief, which is good, but you risk it being misunderstood. Your use of the winking smiley face is ambiguous and rather derivative.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-88279400821351401432008-07-18T10:47:00.000-05:002008-07-18T10:47:00.000-05:00Eden, seems just about right to me. :)Eden, seems just about right to me. :)Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-90956443989550830302008-07-18T10:35:00.001-05:002008-07-18T10:35:00.001-05:00I think it's funny that there's critique of the po...I think it's funny that there's critique of the post on critique ;)Stephaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18127448645515191294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-14001178693078853522008-07-18T10:35:00.000-05:002008-07-18T10:35:00.000-05:00Just to make it clear, we have both fiction writer...Just to make it clear, we have both fiction writers and science writers in this discussion. There will be terms that appear to be in common between the two groups but are not. That said, argue away. :)Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-90986006826081745642008-07-18T10:23:00.000-05:002008-07-18T10:23:00.000-05:00Blake, that's a start, but it's a bit vague, imho....Blake, that's a start, but it's a bit vague, imho.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-18395736648665538382008-07-18T10:21:00.001-05:002008-07-18T10:21:00.001-05:00How about "All critiques are data"?How about "All critiques are data"?Blake Staceyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13977394981287067289noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-21098423547087680782008-07-18T10:21:00.000-05:002008-07-18T10:21:00.000-05:00I totally agree with the solicited vs. unsolicited...I totally agree with the solicited vs. unsolicited distinction, because those are very different social contexts. BUt I'll be dollars to donuts that a third or more of the sciencebloggers would not accept that distinction if applied to them. "The facts are what the facts are regardless of social context." is what you'll get.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-33783740198143015692008-07-18T10:00:00.000-05:002008-07-18T10:00:00.000-05:00Just a bit. Perhaps different wording as Eden sugg...Just a bit. Perhaps different wording as Eden suggested. "Wrong" was likely just a poor word choice.:)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-75173745378200385892008-07-18T09:45:00.000-05:002008-07-18T09:45:00.000-05:00Mari, Eden, thanks for the comments. Obviously, #7...Mari, Eden, thanks for the comments. Obviously, #7 still needs some work. :)Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-6369166773005953082008-07-18T09:37:00.000-05:002008-07-18T09:37:00.000-05:00I think #7, in spirit, is true. I think in the con...I think #7, in spirit, is true. I think in the context of someone doing genuine critique, the purpose is to assist the writer. No one is going to spend hours on a read & crit that serves no purpose other than to tear down the writer. And any reader can have any opinion, even if it's "this sucks."<BR/><BR/>I think it's the word "wrong" that is the problem. I have had crits that were "wrong" -- like telling me blue jeans didn't exist in 1938. That's wrong. It also clouded the rest of the feedback. But when it comes to stuff like tone, character, etc. and it's opinion, there may be something useful in the crit even though the writer thinks it's wrong. If the reader/critiquer isn't picking up what you're putting down, the work needs to be re-examined at the very least.Stephaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18127448645515191294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-53474113751884509242008-07-18T09:30:00.000-05:002008-07-18T09:30:00.000-05:00I also disagree with #7. Not all critique is good ...I also disagree with #7. Not all critique is good critique or even meant in the spirit "I'm doing this to help you". Not all critique fits in with the story you're trying to tell or within with the world you've set that story. Moreover, critique written with the sole intent of "blowing sunshine" isn't helpful - to anybody.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38764987.post-218453109720230582008-07-18T09:29:00.000-05:002008-07-18T09:29:00.000-05:00Oh, I will reread it. I just want to be able to do...Oh, I will reread it. I just want to be able to do it dispassionately. As for it being a critique, there is a big difference between solicited and unsolicited feedback.<BR/><BR/>And I think you're quite capable of telling them what you think all by yourself. :) I'm not sure, though, that extreme statements are very helpful in this case. You're dealing with people who are used to making important fine distinctions. Unless you want to point to specific extreme examples, which I haven't seen in the 7 or 8 reviews I've read, extreme statements appear to be getting a "you're distorting what I'm saying" response. I don't think that's what you're looking for.Stephanie Zvanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15182490110208080002noreply@blogger.com